Project Educate: Free Verse

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PoetryOD's interview of spoems and AzizrianDaoXrak in regards to Free Verse Poetry. Held on March 6th at 8:28 at Project Educate Studios, L.A.



[ begin transmission ]

PoetryOD: *taps the microphone* is this thing on?


spoems: I can hear you, loud and clear!




PoetryOD: Oh. We’re on. Okay. Hello and welcome to Project Educate’s exclusive interview with Free-Verse brainiacs spoems and AzizrianDaoXrak! Today we are going to discuss free verse poetry, what that means and some great examples of it, and some of the issues it creates. We are also going to finally hear the latest news on Shane’s upcoming album “I never touched her” and talk about what it’s like backstage with One Direction and find out the exclusive gossip on Azi’s infamous Vegas wedding to Richard Armitage!


AzizrianDaoXrak: Vegas wedding? I don't know what you're talking about.... :shifty:


spoems: Haha, well . . . that album is on hold for the time being, pending some legal proceedings. But yes, I'm excited to help out with Project Educate, and to be able to contribute to the discussion of free/open verse poetry.


AzizrianDaoXrak: Yep, like spoems I'm SO EXCITED to be here ^^ I've had a long love affair with free verse, so I'm excited to talk about my favorite literary style.


PoetryOD: Well your contributions and excitement are, of course, very welcome. It’s a delight to have you here in the studio, even if you refuse to provide me with autographed pictures. So to start us off with our discussion today it’s probably important to explain to our listeners what we mean by free verse poetry, and whether or not it is the same as open verse.


spoems: The American Heritage Illustrated Encyclopaedic Dictionary (1987) defines “free verse” or Vers Libre as
Verse that does not follow a conventional metrical or stanzaic pattern and has either an irregular rhyme or no rhyme.
The term “open verse” does not generally appear in most dictionary references, and usually seems to be considered synonymous with free verse. Sometimes, open verse is really meant as “open form” poetry, or poetic forms that do not have strict metrical, syllabic or rhyming rules.  If we term it as “open form”, then there are some that maintain it does have a different meaning than free verse; that open form poetry is simply a poem that utilizes something other than rhyme or meter to create a poetic form.  The poetic device in “open form” might be a heightened importance put on the imagery, diction and meaning instead of relying on structure.  This is not a universal definition by any stretch.


AzizrianDaoXrak: Totes what he said. It's a slippery beast. I'm looking forward to talking about what it looks like out in its native habitat, but here in the studio I think spoems’ (and the American Heritage - BOW DOWN IN WORSHIP) definition is as close as we're going to get.


PoetryOD: So that’s why they have separate off-shore bank accounts!


spoems: I think they use the same money launderers. Like I said, there is some some slight difference in speaking about “open form” versus “open verse”; the latter being much more general in most contexts.


AzizrianDaoXrak: Yes definitely.


PoetryOD: That all sounds credible slash suspicious, but I will leave that to the FBI *gives AzizrianDaoXrak a panicked “that was all way too smart for my brain” look*. Anyhoo, you've told us about free verse poetry, can either of you give us, your loyal audience, more information about when it first became well known or anything like that?


AzizrianDaoXrak: Ironically, as a historian, I can't give you much of a background on when it first appeared. I definitely tend to think of Whitman as offering some of the first examples of free verse, but beyond that I'm not sure. Maybe I just remember him because he was the first poet for a long while, historically speaking, whose work I actually liked...


PoetryOD starts giggling.


spoems: Yes, most art historians maintain that the birth of free verse poetry occurred in 19th America with Walt Whitman. He eschewed the principles of heavily metered structure for more of an uneven, sprawling kind of verse, as is evidenced in his famous poems “Leaves of Grass” and “Song of Myself.”  


spoems: In parallel, there was apparently a French movement during the same period where poets were moving away from even metered poetry.  Authur Rimbaud is generally credited with writing one of the first works of free verse with his poem “Saison en Enfer (A Season in Hell)”. But I more closely associate Whitman with the beginnings of free verse.


PoetryOD: Really? I never liked him. He used to park outside of my house. There’s a perfectly good driveway outside your own house, why do you need to park in front of mine?? Animals. Oh, so, why do you think free verse is so popular now?


spoems: Haha, old man Whitman used to park his river boat in front of your house?  I see the attraction to Whitman, and I can’t deny his influence,  but he’s not one of my favorites any more.  


PoetryOD: Don’t judge me, I like a waterfront view.


AzizrianDaoXrak: Well, on deviantART, I think it has a lot of appeal when it comes to writing free verse in terms of being (theoretically) easier. In terms of why it’s popular to read... I'm not sure, I feel like there's a lot more freedom to use words how you need to. I think there's a lot to be said, as well, for the fact that it tends more AWAY from the sing-song-y.


PoetryOD: I like to think of myself as non-conformist to existing poetry rules, but I guess in actuality, I'm just lazy...


spoems: Quite a large number of examples of free verse exist on dA, some of which are amazing and inspiring, some thought-provoking and experimental, and some which resemble a learning experience.  At first, I thought of my own lack of adherence to metered, rhyming verse as “lazy”, but then I realized that it has more to do with what poetry I like reading.  I always feel somewhat annoyed when the seams of a poem show, like when the poetic structure becomes a cumbersome machine, one which you begin to anticipate.  On the other hand, the best formulamatic poems are ones that sound like music.  In those cases, the structure enhances the musicality.  Conversely, musicality can sometimes be a difficult to achieve with free verse because it can become conversational or prose-like without a discernible form.  I think this is the intriguing challenge of writing free verse, and it’s one that I enjoy.


PoetryOD: I agree, I remember when I was about 14 showing my mum my poetry and she said to me “I don’t like poems that rhyme, because it means you're bending your meaning to fit the language available to you”, and that really stuck with me. I think that rhyming without it seeming forced and trite is a real art form that is under appreciated, and I think that a lot of modern poets have moved away from rhyme because it’s too easy to lose your original meaning. There are some amazing poets right here on DeviantART who are writing free verse, here are some of my favourites;
the cocooning of pangeatell me about continents and oceans
and i'll tell you about highways
and planes.
            continents -
            fall apart
            you say,
            oceans -
            destroy them
and i say:
but look,
that isn't an ending,
that's just
change.
            pangea was
            beautiful,
            it didn't
            need to change.
and i say:
we all need to change,
even beauty must adapt.
and i say:
i adapted,
pangea adapted,
why can't
Human Nature    When you are young,
they will treat you with the softness of spring.
They will guide you through the winter winds and
over snowy hills, admiring the brilliance of your
midday innocence; pulling daisies from the earth
just to place them in your hair. And they will
whisper to each other of how beautiful you are.
    When you grow older,
they will treat you with the indifferences of autumn.
They will urge you from the complacency of your own
fleeting fulfillments, and they will watch your
brilliance fade with the swiftness of the sky. You
will shed your fragile childhood with the colors of
the trees, and you will learn to face the winter winds
without their guiding arms. And they will whisper to
each other of how beautiful you are.
    When you are grown,
they will treat you with the coldness of winter. They
will leave you bare and naked before the ravenous wolves,
expecting you to fend for your own forgotten brilliance,
asking why you've kept those wilting daisies in your hair.
They
Poetry,She is stardust leaving sweet bones
in her wake.  A trail of poetic destruction
conceived in verse--answering questions
with kisses.  There is a hunger in her
freckled constellations, like spider webs
woven together with golden thread.
Like the wild roses she braids in her hair:
She walks backboned and head held high;
the strongest of letters on a page
left to rest in your mouth.


spoems: I think that many poets on dA, especially new ones, embrace free verse for a couple of reasons.  First, free verse is most closely associated with the idea of modern poetry. The other reason is that writing metered, structured poetry is not particularly easy (as you implied, earlier.)  And so, most new poets on dA tend to gravitate towards free verse because they assume that freedom from poetic rules affords them the best possibility for success.  
Some of my dA favorites;
Dear Readeron the roof
simpering with
the pigeons
i throw
sheen after sheen
from buckets of paint;
you do all
the work
getting
in the
way.
awnings
spattered
like lips
with the color
of kisses
shiver
and move.
and listen
to this:
the birds
open their mouths
in the rain
spread one wing
then another
and lean out
and over--
the river
opens
onto salt
as the moon
blooms
like a coin
in a fist;
lovers
part lips
while
friends
part ways.
the bartender
peels a lime;
the doorman
pulls at the door
while the waitress
clears the table.
i open
a window,
you open
your eyes:
work
is making space.
here and
i have
made
room
for you.
watch a monkey build a watchfor the better
of worse
I was made this way
dropped different & drifting
some distance from divine
a tool gifted with the
breath to blame
its maker
what nature has nurtured
these cells
will divide
I can't figure out
the life of me for
the life of me
omnipotence
or at least no
impotence
fostered conception
(with no conception)
of immaculate design
of the miraculous
as mine
the impetus of this
existence
often impetuously
inclined
despite whomever's
taking measure
the
descent
is
never kind
forgotten's
all I'm getting
we're all given
up
by time
Anagrams in the airThieved
by mouth-envelope;
my phonics
caged
in alphabet-zoos,
my heart-hospital
swirling with apiaries,
as I wait outside
a name.
If I could
eventually
say anything at all,
I’d tell you
how you loom
secret heuristics
inside those delta-pyramids
that snack on your pupils.
I’d tell you
I’d bleed out
the world’s cathedrals
in weight,
to say anything
that sparked a star
in the quiet knock
of your night.
I’d scratch
the larks
from their wallpapers,
until my nails, none,
lift their wings
and give them flight.
This thirsting
pulse
knows you
inside the highest
of blooms
and
we can never be
ungone.




PoetryOD: A lot of free verse here on DA has elements of e.e. cummings’ style. Do you think those two things are related?


spoems: e.e. cummings had an interesting style.  He seemed to write a in a more traditional lyrical meter, but then he added strange syntax and typographical flourishes.  His experimental formatting makes him the most iconic of flag bearers for the popular notion of pure poetic freedom.  But I feel this is a bit erroneous, because he was actually quite poetically disciplined.  What I always noticed about cummings what that he was a romantic of the highest order, and his poems sometimes seemed almost like giddy nursery rhymes. But on closer inspection, you realize that many of them were metaphysical in nature; evidence of influence by the transcendentalists of his time, perhaps.  His major influence on my poetry would be the lack of capitalization, specifically of the first person “i” pronoun, which is a prevalent style on dA, as well as in modern poetry in general.


PoetryOD: So it’s easier to write free verse, but if an art form is easier to do, then doesn't it make it harder to create something really impressive?


AzizrianDaoXrak: Not necessarily. At least, *I* find fixed-form, particularly metered and rhyming poetry, to be REALLY difficult to write. I don't necessarily think it's harder to make something impressive, it's just more tempting not to work hard - good diction, technique, and careful editing should still be a part of the writing process, even if you're writing "free-for-all" poetry.


PoetryOD: Yeah, I agree Azi, that temptation is stronger. Are there other disadvantages to the free verse form do you think?


spoems: The idea that free verse is easier to write is somewhat flawed logic.  It may be easier to write verse that has no predefined form, but I think it is difficult to write good free verse poetry for this reason:  There is a common misconception that free verse means there is no form at all, (i.e. that it is free from form) when in fact, what it really means is that the form (which poetry must have) has no name because it’s created on the spot; a new set of rules for every poem!  This is where imagination, extended metaphor, and the delicate confluence of spoken language and exotic diction mingle together on the page.  And this is where understanding meter and assonance and natural pauses are helpful because you can apply fixed form concepts to the free form verse.  In other words, it helps to be a master of form before you go off and create your own.


PoetryOD: Do you guys write in free verse?




PoetryOD: haha, well the rime of the ancient mariner was an epic poem but still incredible! It's just really hard to maintain strength in a poem that long!


AzizrianDaoXrak: It's still kind of long, but more manageable. I wanted to really play around with different tones through punctuation and line breaks - conveying urgency through ways of writing. Yes, it *is* hard to maintain poem strength for that length. I don't think I'll be writing a 3000 word poem again for a long time.


spoems: I write exclusively in free verse, but not intentionally.  In other words, I'm not out to write in any particular style, except for the style of the moment.  If a fixed stanza-like structure comes from the poem of the moment, then maybe it's really a fixed form.  But I had no prior intention of writing it that way, so to me, it's still just poetry.  Other form-like classifications, such as concrete, are really free form poems that have a thematic form.  Again, free form (to me) does not mean "free from all form".


PoetryOD: C’mon spoems, show us one of yours! I’ll show you mine if you show me yours.


spoems: Oh lord, we're going there?  Haha, OK!  How about this one?
the shut-in
where are these keyholes to the Equinox? the stars huddle
like alien nettle,
a gray chime of wrens scaling tree limbs and middays,   
  jittery
fruit;
Darwin has no lines for me
to speak
of.
i've sheetrocked the blistering ivies and blossoms.
i've glassed out daubers and frightening mollusks
pillowing through mud honey and minute old ruins.
intimate with my quiet desk, my paper hoard
i'm still a coward; the envelopes, Obama glass, the dozen unused spiral
diaries are menacing concoctions, minotaurs of lost dimensions.
i used to sleep in creek-beds.

Or, back to my point about concrete being more of a subset of free verse than of a fixed form, when I was writing my poem Comforter, the idea to make a concrete image out of some of the text was an organic, stream of consciousness decision - it was a form created on the spur of the moment during the writing process.  The upper portion that appears to have a shape is contrasted against its antithesis - the bottom strophe - which has no form at all.  Some people even commented that they considered that part prose.  The point is, my only intention was to write a poem, and only after the fact were definitions and classifications of said form (or lack, thereof) applicable.  So, perhaps another definition of free verse might simply be the writing of a poem free from the intention of conforming to a predefined form.  All apologies to anyone that accidentally writes a sonnet.  :lol:


PoetryOD: I totally agree with that, although sometimes there are happy accidents, so just pretend like that's what you meant to do :giggle:. Although I think Comforter would be classed as concrete poetry, wouldn't it? I like to mix concrete poetry (you can find out more about concrete poetry this week in Project Educate! Just stay tuned) and free verse, and I like to make up new forms.

Moving swiftly on, do you think its possible for a new form to be created through free verse, and then become popular and eventually become a new recognised form?


AzizrianDaoXrak: I definitely think it's possible. SilverInkblot has been making new forms through free verse, for example she's got a specific form for color poems, and has started a project for making poems entirely from deviation titles.


PoetryOD: So would you agree if I said that free verse is the modern poetry revolution?


AzizrianDaoXrak: "Revolution"! Makes it sound so dramatic, haha. I'm not sure what that means, honestly. I don't know what a poetic revolution would look like.


PoetryOD: haha, well I think it is. It enables innovation!


AzizrianDaoXrak: Oh, definitely. Free verse, to me, is an invitation to play with language - push it to its utmost limits, one way or another. :)


spoems: Yes!  It's precisely that: an invitation to move into an open space and make a new definition for poetry.


PoetryOD: Sometimes people say that they can’t write poetry, and I think - what a peculiar thing to say. With poetry there are no set rules, like spoems I believe with poetry you can do anything you want as long as you do it on purpose. For me, that sums up free verse. How would you sum it up for people curious about this form of poetry?


AzizrianDaoXrak: I think that sums it up for me, too, but I generally add that the wonderful thing about free verse is that it provides such a wonderful opportunity to really push your creative boundaries. It is an excuse to experiment, essentially.


spoems: I hate to try and sum up poetry.  I would say it is finding some inner context of experience and then initializing a special pallet of words in order to paint an abstract/metaphoric portrait of this experience, and to do so in some song-like fashion.  


PoetryOD: Is there anything else we should be mentioning, do you think?


AzizrianDaoXrak: Well, *I* would like to take the opportunity to remind people to suggest DDs as often as possible, but beyond that - nope!


spoems: The future of poetry and its definition are in the hands of modern poets, and no one else; not publishers, not English professors, just poets.  


PoetryOD: Well in that case I think we will end our show there, tune in next week for our interview with the legendary Brian Griffin, playwright, time-traveller and all round dog.


AzizrianDaoXrak: Thank you so much for having me in to chat!




PoetryOD: Phew, so glad that’s over with. Can I have a glass of water? Where’s Steven I need my water. HELLO?


[ end transmission ]


With thanks to the folks at Project Educate studios, the recording crew, spoems, AzizrianDaoXrak and dreamsinstatic for providing water. Stay tuned for more articles on others forms all this week right here on the number one channel for educational fun!



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almcdermid's avatar
Excellent discussion. thetaoofchaos struck on something of particular importance with, "There is a common misconception that free verse means there is no form at all, (i.e. that it is free from form) when in fact, what it really means is that the form (which poetry must have) has no name because it’s created on the spot; a new set of rules for every poem!" I've either thrown out, or later become dissatisfied, with many poems poems because than revealing their own form or structure, I come to see them as simply words on a page.